Syngenta’s Hiring Upgrade with Winston - Danilo Bulatovic - Hiring Happy Hour - Episode # 041
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Syngenta’s Hiring Upgrade with Winston - Danilo Bulatovic - Hiring Happy Hour - Episode # 041

Hi, everyone.

Welcome back to another exciting
episode of Hiring Happy Hour.

Uh, today's exciting because hear me
talk about Winston, but I'm not the

only one that loves him, and now you get
to hear it from one of our customers.

He is a global talent acquisition
and sourcing professional with

extensive experience working
across international markets.

He specializes in talent sourcing,
recruitment strategy, and building

connections with candidates with a
particular focus on innovation approaches

to identify the engaging talent.

has held regional and global talent
acquisition roles, working across digital

recruitment, talent sourcing, and building
strong, very strong talent pipelines.

Global lead of talent acquisition
sourcing and operations technology

at Syngenta, please join me
in welcoming Danny Balutovic.

Welcome, Danny.

Thank you, Nicole, and great
to-- thanks for having me

I have truly enjoyed our prep call
because I think it's customers like you

and people like you that truly an impact
and help me to realize that when I'm

drinking the Kool-Aid of SmartRecruiters
and Winston, I'm not alone.

and so I am very excited for you to
share just what you've done, uh, in

talent acquisition at Syngenta with AI,
with Winston, with SmartRecruiters, but

more so a proud moment for you and your
organization and what you've achieved.

So I am not going to belabor this
with more fluff, but I want us

to get straight to talking about
what your hiring happy hour is.

So can you share more with our
organization, kind of our, our

listeners, I guess they are our
organization, we're all one, uh, what

this journey has looked like for you?

What was the problem?

What were you looking to
solve, and how did you do that?

what we put this as the AI, um, use cases
for, for this year as, uh, the strategic,

uh, roadmap is, uh, the, the, the top
priority is actually top of the funnel.

So what we did identify is that
majority of the time for our talent

acquisition partners is that where they
spend it at reviewing applications.

Uh, and in some cases, depending from
region to region, it can be thousands of

applications, it can be a few hundreds.

And the estimate is that they spend
thirty to fifty percent of their

time just reviewing applications.

The challenge with that is, sits
is that we see that, uh, first of

all, uh, every recruiter, uh, has
its own, uh, ways of working it.

So w- what we want to address is the
consistency, uh, also the fatigue,

because you know what it's like, uh,
spending hours and hours of reviewing

CVs and, uh, you know, i- i- in all
that, uh, journey, you do tend to miss

out potentially some great candidates.

So that is why we wanted, uh, on one side
to ensure that actually our recruiters

do invest their time, uh, based on their
capabilities to become more strategic

talent acquisition partners and spend
time more, uh, with business and to be

consistent in reviewing applications.

So this is why we started the
discussion with Smartrecruiters,

how can we address actually this
issue with top of the funnel?

And, uh, this is where Winsta Match
and, uh, Winsta Screen came along.

So w- as two really powerful,
uh, tools, especially when you--

when, uh, they join together.

Um, so with Winsta Match, first
of all, what we wanted to, to

use the tool is to help us, um,
connect and prioritize candidates.

And I'm really highlighting on this
because for us it's very important

that, uh, we don't have the, um,
automated decision-making by the AI

tool, but to have, uh, human oversight
and human on- in the loop, meaning that

the talent acquisition partners are
the decision makers and, uh, the tool

itself is helping them to prioritize
candidates by linking, uh, all those

three areas, skills, uh, experience,
and education with the job description.

Uh, making sure that, uh, actually we
see them as a good fit, uh, not only

keywords for keywords where, where
we're looking at the old technology,

but it's rather looking beyond that.

What are the skills
that they can use today?

What are the required
skills for the future?

What is the trajectory and, uh, what is it
that they can actually, uh, use, uh, for

the next stages in their careers, looking
at how they, uh, they grow and progress.

I love this

and this is something what, uh, really,
uh, we are using to, to, to, like I

said, to address, uh, the time being
spent on reviewing candidates and at

the same time to make sure that we can
give an equal opportunities for all the

candidates, especially in those cases
when we have thousands of applications

in some, uh, regions of the world.

Uh, together with that, what, uh, we
started, uh, with the implementation

of, of is for Winston Screen.

And once again, for Winston Screen,
asking those questions, it's not about,

uh, actually looking to disqualify
candidates, but rather to qualify them,

to make sure that actually they have
those little, uh, important things that

maybe they didn't highlight in their
resumes, uh, and that we can actually

qualify them against these positions.

And when you join answers from
Winston Screen and then with Winston

Match, it does give a really great
insightful way for recruiters to go

and actually review, uh, these findings
and also connect with the, the actual

resume of, of candidates and decide
who they want to move forward with

Danny, a few questions for you because
I think this is very powerful, and

recent conversations I've had with a
number of customers, people are still

doing things manually top of funnel.

This is a top priority for
a large, a large enterprise

organizations, which is surprising.

You think that they would be
further along on this journey.

So as they look to this, um, whether
you're large or small, you talked

about Winston Match truly helping
you to m- I guess, uh, narrow the fit

of the individuals while having the
human touch there make the decisions.

Can you share how this
improved the process, right?

When we talked, you said some people were
just starting at the top, some people

were filtering by alphabetical order.

Um, it really was a choose your own
adventure on which candidates were

looked at, and now you eliminate, if
you want to call that, the bias of that,

and everyone has an equal opportunity.

But share with us how you also
helped to improve process with

this by integrating Winston Match

Yeah.

And, uh, that's, that's,
that's a great, uh, connection

we discussed from last time.

And this is, this is the
habits that everybody have.

Um, whoever is in the talent acquisition,
um, industry, they know that, uh, and

whoever went through the path of being
a, a recruiter, we all have our habits.

Do you start from the beginning?

Do you start from the end?

You start from this week because,
oh, Monday is a perfect day,

let me see who applied today.

Um, and, and this is the inconsistency,
uh, which, uh, which we want to address,

um, i-in that sense because, um, you
know, the process is reviewed in that

way that once again, you give an equal
opportunity to everyone, and you make

sure that by, uh, by starting, okay,
I'll start from the end, and then there

are 500 candidates who already applied.

You're not going to go from the, the
first 50, and potentially maybe you

have the best fit candidates in there.

So in this way, actually the
prioritization goes based on their

experience, based on their skill
set, based on their education,

and ranking them in that area.

What we did highlight and what we
actually, uh, follow as, uh, w- some--

I will share some findings so far,
is that actually, uh, recruiters

are reviewing candidates from all
the scores because we are still

learning how to utilize the tool.

And also, um, you know, to be frank, we
all always want to assess and see what

is the reliability of the tool, and, uh,
uh, you know, you have false positives,

false negatives, and how do we address
that to make sure that we actually don't

miss out on some of the candidates.

That's why we have the process that,
uh, the, the recruiters are actually

reviewing not only the high- uh, higher
score candidates, meaning four and

threes, threes, but actually reviewing
ones and twos to make sure that, uh, we

do, we do and, um, randomly check the
candidates to, to see if actually the

tool does give us the best fit candidates.

the process,

To explain this

yeah, please

as when you listen to the radio,
I'm aging myself, I would every

channel before I chose my song.

And I find that to be the same validating
factor of, okay, well, I wanna make sure

I'm not missing the good stuff, right?

So you do have to look at those ones
and twos to see if it's truly reliable.

Um, and I appreciate this exercise

Yes, yes.

Because we are also playing the, the
curiosity game because, you know, you

have to be curious and, uh, if, if you
really want to get all the answers, you

have to, to, uh, to see what's in there.

Uh, what is, what is important
finding for us is that, uh, we

did, uh, um, so the, the recruiters
reviewed 11 and 22% for scores one,

scores two, and then a bit higher
percentage around thir- 30 percentage

each, uh, for the threes and fours.

What we can learn so far after,
what's been now, five months of, uh,

utilizing Winster Match is that more
than 60% of candidates who's been,

uh, um, reviewed and scored for,
they move into the interview stage.

So it does show you that actually
the tool can be treated as reliable.

Still, we do continue reviewing
all the level of, uh, candidates

because, you know, some- sometimes
happens that, uh, candidates are

not, not professional CV writers.

Uh, and even though that the tool is,
um, actually applying much, much more

complex technology than it used to be in
the past, depending on the file type and

how they upload it, it can happen that,
uh, some of the things can be missed out.

So that's why we want to make sure that we
give this equal opportunity to everyone.

So the process has changed in the
sense that we can see that, uh, the

small- uh, the, the smaller number
of applications has been reviewed,

but then the quality is still there.

We can see that, uh, there are less
candidates moving forward to the

interview stage and actually affecting
the number of interviews to hires as well.

So this is something what we can learn
from an early stage, really proving that

actually it does reduce the time that
you spend at the top of the funnel, uh,

and also, uh, improving the quality, uh,
of the candidates being moved forward

this because we get asked all the
time, like, how do we validate that

the people at the top of that list
from match are the right people?

And you are giving us an external
customer data point to say 60% of

the time those fours move forward.

So thank you for that.

I want to go to screen because
I, like you, think this is like a

perfect marriage top of funnel, right?

This is where we hear a lot of our
customers say, you know, "Can I

customize the matching?" And we say
no, and there's a number of reasons

related to bias and legislation and, and
allowing the tool to do what it does.

But I think this is where the element
of screen truly is a powerful, uh,

second component to this, and actually
probably the first considering it's

part of the screening question.

So weighted screening questions, then
those also with match are prioritized.

Give us an example of a screening
question that you, and without, you

know, all those that are going to
apply to jobs at Syngenta after this

will know, but that helps you to truly
validate what you said earlier around

knowing that they have that expertise
or that certification or that capability

that you need to move them forward.

Yeah.

Uh, the questions can vary, uh, because we
are looking at the, the, the global scope.

Uh, so it can vary from region to region.

When I say region, for instance,
North America, Europe, in,

uh, EMEA, then LATAM, Brazil.

So it can vary depending on what
are the, the, the key, uh, elements

important, also with the function.

So for instance, uh, in Europe, uh,
it-- we can come across if someone is

eligible to work in the country, and
you have some-sometimes a great fit of a

candidate who does require sponsorship.

And if we don't provide a sponsorship,
uh, the, the recruiters, uh, wouldn't

invest time to go for the phone screen
interview with the candidates only

to find out that, uh, some of the
candidates do require sponsorship.

So this is something what you can
apply in certain, um, in certain

countries where this is very important.

Also, it's really important to highlight
that, uh, you have to be cautious what

kind of questions you ask in the different
regions and different countries, because

what you can ask, for instance, in India,
it can be illegal to be asked in different

country, like in, in US or in Europe.

Um, what we see a lot of value is
also, for instance, for IT and digital

function, where you have to be very
specific ab-about certain technologies

that, uh, candidates spend time
working and for what period of time.

Because, you know, just using
one language doesn't say enough.

It-it's about the, the,
the tool that they use it.

And this can help you also
to understand what is the

qualification of the candidate.

Once again, I really need to,
to emphasize this, this, that we

are not using Winston Screen to
disqualify any of the candidates.

The, the, the sole purpose is really
to qualify them, to link their

experience, skills, uh, a-and the
knowledge they have in the role to

make sure that they actually do, do
have all the key requirements that

they need to be successful in the job.

Going back to that top of the funnel,
how that saves time to recruiters,

you know that when you pick up the
phone and when you talk to candidates

for that phone screen interview, you
don't just ask a question and you

receive no, and you hang up the phone.

Hopefully, not many people are using.

Exactly.

You would have still to go through
those fifteen to twenty minutes

of phone screen interview when you
realize from the very beginning that

the candidate is not a good fit.

And this is where you really reduce
this number of phone screen, phone

screens that are being performed by
recruiter before you decide how many

candidates you want to move forward
to the, uh, to hiring manager review

and, uh, later to the interview stage

So you may or may not know this, but
I think that you are a celebrity in

your organization because of this
effort and what you've achieved.

What has been some of the praise that
recruiters and hiring managers have

given around the exponential time
that Syngenta is saving top of funnel?

we still don't have… So I, I don't
want to throw the numbers like,

uh, based on the, the gut feeling.

So I'm very, uh, data-driven,
so I, I don't like to play

with the incorrect information.

So far, because, uh, we implemented,
um, uh, Winston Screen on, uh,

uh, 7th of September, so it, it's
still early stage, I would say.

So, so far we have a qualitative
feedback coming from recruiters, and

we actually recently went out with a
survey as well, uh, asking them, "How

do you feel that, uh, Winston Match and
Winston Screen is impacting, uh, your

work?" And we have a lot of positive,
uh, responses, uh, especially those

who started using Winston Screen more
and more r- for the, all the reasons

that I just mentioned, because they can
actually spend less time finding answers

that they, they have already provided
through these, uh, Winston Screen.

So I don't have the data
to support this yet.

Maybe in the near future Sometimes
it's also about the feeling, uh, that

something is actually creating an
impact on your, uh, day, uh, day work

I would say that, uh, uh, we
will have another one, and

we'll look at engagement, right?

Like hiring manager, recruiter
engagement, how many of your users

are using this with rave reviews?

Two, we'll look at quality of
hire, and then the no-brainer,

you know, top of funnel, uh, time
savings, which equals cost savings.

So, uh, we will come back to all of that.

But I wanna know where
you're going next, right?

You have done an amazing job of rolling
out Match and now Screen, um, excited

to help those recruiters and other
users, and even the candidate experience

top of funnel as we think about, you
know, making sure they're not stagnant

for too long and no communication.

Exactly

for Syngenta going next?

So we are discussing our roadmap, and we
are looking for different technologies

and different solutions that can
help us further, uh, on the path.

How you can, uh, um, make the
whole journey a bit easier,

to automate the process.

Still, uh, the, the intention is
not for us at least to replace, uh,

the, the, the, the, the human or
the recruiters with their job, but

really to make their life easier.

Once again, going back at the beginning,
we want them to, to be able to be closer

to the business, to become strategic
partners, strategic talent acquisition

partners, where they can have much,
much more qualitative discussions with

the hiring managers, uh, and to ensure
that they actually have a chance to,

to perform all the capabilities they
have and also to, to excel further

and grow into, uh, their roles.

So, uh, the whole roadmap is about how
can we make everybody's life easier

in, from one side recruiters and also
looking for the solutions how we can

actually embed, uh, either agents or
different, uh, ways for candidates to

find all the answers they, that they need.

And what we want to, to also address
is how do we encourage them to apply

for the roles where they are good fit.

Because in the past, uh, I can
say, uh, by being 14 years in the

industry, we w- we were really focusing
on how do we attract candidates.

And i- it was important, like, okay, we
need to attract them, but now it's about

the quality because you want to attract
a good quality of candidates because

nobody's benefiting from the numbers.

Uh, having hundreds and thousands of a-
applicants, nobody's benefiting from that.

So we want to see how we can actually
use the technology to give, uh, needed

answers and to help actually candidates
to see whether they are potentially

good fit for certain roles or to guide
them to help them to, to find a good fit

roles for themselves they can apply for

love this.

So last question before
we learn more about you.

What would be your advice
to an organization that is

considering Match and/or Screen?

Um, where do they start, and what
is a must-have as you think about

going through this transformation?

first of all, uh, what we started
and what I think is the important

thing is to understand what is
the problem that you want to fix.

Uh, and I think this
is the, the key thing.

Uh, and to explore, uh, all the options.

Uh, what I really love is the
curiosity base, meaning that always

be curious about what are the
opportunities you can gain from.

Uh, and I, I think this is really
important aspect, uh, because without

trying certain things, you will never
know what's-- uh, whether something worked

or not, because, you know, better to
try and fail than never to try things.

And I think it's inevitable really
to, to, to see how the technology, uh,

can, uh, help us in day to d- uh, day
life because some people are scared.

You can hear a lot of talks about AI
taking over our jobs, which I really

don't believe that, uh, it will happen.

Maybe to a certain percentage, but not
on the scale where everybody's afraid of.

It's like the introduction from
paper, you move to, to computers.

Did computers replace all the jobs?

No, they didn't.

But what is really important is that,
once again, with the curiosity and

with the growth mindset, you have to
continuously invest in yourself and

adapt yourself to the future and to
the te- technology that you have.

So obviously upskilling teams, uh, helping
them understand what is the main benefit

from that is also a important aspect
because you have to get that in mind

and you have to, to take away that there
is no place for fear in, in this game.

It's all about let's work together
in seeing what are the, what are

the things we can be better at
because that can help us grow

I love that.

It's the value selling.

What's in it for me in partnership
with AI versus in replacement.

So, um, great,

Exactly.

for our audience and our listeners.

All right, Danny, we are going to
switch to learn more about this curious

gentleman with me on the screen, and
what your personal happy hour is.

What brings a smile to
your face outside of work?

Oh, outside of my work?

Oof, uh, many things.

I mean, you know, it, it is common
thing people saying about, um, uh,

you know, family and kids, and this,
this is definitely something what, uh,

shaped all of us or changed all of us.

Uh, what I personally like, uh, to, to,
to do is to challenge myself and, uh,

Okay.

I'm a curious person, so in that
sense, in find different ways,

uh, of seeing where my limits are,

so for instance, I played rugby, um,
uh, European rugby, um, for 18 years

in the past and, uh, for the last 11
years I moved into different thing.

It's in triathlon, uh, and
doing the Ironman and just

seeing where the boundaries are.

And, uh, you know, just want
to see what we are capable of.

And actually that helps a lot, uh,
because you can really see, uh, it's

not about overcoming challenges,
uh, on a physical level because

you're all prepared for that.

But actually on the mental level,
because you can apply that throughout

life because, uh, you know, in life
we come across many difficult moments.

Uh, but then the, the question is how you
approach that and how you deal with all

those moments and how you react to it.

And this is something what,
uh, um, helped me through the

sport because you had a all…

a, a lot of ups and downs.

You had a lot of, um, uh, dark moments,
meaning the physical endurance.

And, uh, definitely this is, this is
something what, uh, I really love to

challenge myself and also to be capable
to, to, to be there with kids and

challenging them as well, uh, through
that mindset because it helps them grow.

What I would like also to, uh, to connect
with the personal and the work-related,

uh, because, um, as I'm in coaching,
certified in coaching and helping a

lot of people to, to grow and develop,
this is something what I really,

that

uh, brings a lot of joy in,
in the work environment.

Um, and especially helping people grow
because for me, this is, uh, this is the

heritage that we can always look back at
and, uh, how many people you helped shape

up, develop, helping grow in their careers
and becoming who they are, uh, today.

I love that.

I love that because I can see it in you
that you are proud of all those that

you have helped impact in your org.

Now, my one question related to Ironmans
or just triathlons, you-- first of all,

you're insanely awesome for doing those.

I think I did a half
and that was my limit.

Which one, uh, which or segment provides
you the best opportunity to think?

Is it the run, the swim, or the bike?

Ooh, that's a great question.

Uh, so I'm a non-swimmer.

I mean, I never trained swimming,

it is the part we all hate at the moment.

But you know, funny thing is, um, funny
thing is that once you come to the point

and what I say you need to go at least
like, uh, 60 miles or 100 kilometers

plus, uh, in the water to start not hating

So I did like a regular Ironman, like
the flat-ish ones, and then I wanted

to try myself with the extreme one.

So extreme is more into mountains.

It's a lot of, uh, climbing on a bike, um,
off-road and run, like going to the peaks.

And there is one which I-- which
has a special, uh, part in my heart.

It's, uh, in Montenegro.

Uh, it's called the Black Lake Extreme,
uh, Triathlon because you swim in a lake

which is on, uh, one-- 1,500 meters,
uh, altitude, and it's beautiful.

It's, it's so nice.

And the funny thing about the extreme,
um, um, let's call it Ironman because

it's the Ironman distance, uh, is that
you actually, uh, you start at, uh,

4:30 in the morning, so it's during
the night, and you swim in the dark.

So literally there are
lights you have to follow.

Uh, you see like blinking
lights from the other swimmers.

And usually that it's not overcrowded
like you would see in other races.

So at some point, especially when, uh, it,
it's coming to, to the dawn slightly, so

it's not like pitch black, but slightly
you can see your, your, your eyes

get used to, uh, to the, to the dark.

You can see like the mountains,
you can see the trees, and you

really connect with nature.

So it's literally darkness in there.

You just have your stroke,
and you know what it's like.

You just have the stroke,
the peace, silence.

You just see like the
mountains, and it's beautiful.

So, you know, in those moments,
once you stop hating it,

swimming can be really good.

Uh, but you know, uh, I don't think that
on the run you have a chance to, to, to

enjoy anything because it's the last bit
and, uh, the marathon is waiting for you.

So marathon on its own, it's, uh, it's
not fun, but, uh, after 180 kilometers

on a bike, it's definitely not fun,

All

at all.

So yeah.

Funny thing is, I would say swimming does
give you a chance to really connect with

yourself, especially when it's in nature,

danny, I will take your word for it.

Um, we're gonna get into the
third part, which is my favorite.

It's a game of this or that.

So, um, you choose one, you choose
both, you elaborate, you don't have to.

We've got about 10 of them, okay?

You ready?

Okay.

Yeah, go for it

AI-powered prioritization or
humor- human-powered intuition

Ooh, AI powered

Review 1,000 applications or
interview 10 qualified candidates

Uh, interview 12-- 10 qualified candidates

more too.

Uh, save time or save money

Isn't that connected in some way?

Say both.

Both

Uh, yes, it is.

More applicants or better matches?

Ah, better matches always.

Perfect resume or perfect potential?

Ooh, I would go with growth potentials

First to apply or best fit for the role

Uh, best fit for the role

keywords or capabilities

Uh, capabilities

Speed to interview or quality of hire

kind of quality of hire

as a co-pilot or AI as a game changer?

Ooh, can I go with both?

All right, now we're gonna get to
some fun ones, not work related.

Uh, sunrise

Okay.

Sunrise.

mountains or ocean?

Mountains

Coffee or tea?

Uh, a lot of coffee, espresso.

you know that has less
caffeine than coffee?

Uh, it depends how you make it
and what is the quantity you have.

So yeah.

I'm throwing one in here.

If, you know, you had your
superhero body, Rugby or Iron Man?

Ooh, that's a tough one.

It's a different stage of my life.

I love them both.

I hear you.

I hear you

It's completely different.

I, I, I don't think it's uncomparable.

Rugby, it's a team sport where
you have different challenges.

You know what they say in rugby?

It's 80 minutes of pretending that you
are not, uh, injured so you can stay

on the, stay with the team members.

Honestly, I, I played more injured than
I played, uh, uh, healthy on that game.

But Ironman is completely different
because it connects more with you

e- because it's only you there.

There is nobody else to save you.

It's just

You.

Dig deep.

Okay.

Definitely

Um, last one.

Beer, wine, or spirits?

Oh, I'm not, I'm not,
I'm not… Uh, spirits.

Yeah.

I'm not into alcohol, but
I would go for spirits

well, what do you do after an Ironman?

What is, what is your thing after
an Ironman to reward yourself?

it depends when.

Uh, so straight after that, you
just get to, to hydrate something

Share.

and go into the cold
pool to, to cool down.

But then the day after, you're looking
for another race, another challenge.

Okay

Even though the whole time
you, you thought like, "Why the

hell did I sign up for this?"

lot about you, Danny.

I have learned a lot about your mentality.

I love it.

I absolutely love it.

Um, tell our friends that are
listening or watching, uh,

where they can connect with you

Uh, well, LinkedIn is, uh, probably the
easiest way, uh, to, to connect and,

uh, to reach out for any questions.

I'm always, uh, happy to connect,
share any experience we have, uh, in,

in the topic we discussed today, for
instance, match and screen or anything

in, uh, related to talent acquisition,
or if they want to make a mistake

in life and go with, uh, Iron Man.

I was just gonna say.

thank you, Danny, for being here today and
for sharing your insight and just, like,

the perseverance and mindset that you
have as it relates to both life and work.

Um, listeners, watchers,
I hope you enjoyed this.

I know I did.

I mean, while I am curious about
Ironmans, I think w- I'll, I'll stay the

track of, you know, just trail running
or, or something along those lines.

But if you do have interest in any of
the topics today, Winston match, Screen,

um, also just TA or career development,
and Ironmans, Danny is the man for you.

Uh, thank you all for
staying tuned with us.

Uh, more to come on the horizon.

And then of course, if you or
have a friend or want to be

on the show, please reach out.

Thanks everyone.