Hi, everyone.
Welcome back to another exciting
episode of Hiring Happy Hour.
Uh, today's exciting because hear me
talk about Winston, but I'm not the
only one that loves him, and now you get
to hear it from one of our customers.
He is a global talent acquisition
and sourcing professional with
extensive experience working
across international markets.
He specializes in talent sourcing,
recruitment strategy, and building
connections with candidates with a
particular focus on innovation approaches
to identify the engaging talent.
has held regional and global talent
acquisition roles, working across digital
recruitment, talent sourcing, and building
strong, very strong talent pipelines.
Global lead of talent acquisition
sourcing and operations technology
at Syngenta, please join me
in welcoming Danny Balutovic.
Welcome, Danny.
Thank you, Nicole, and great
to-- thanks for having me
I have truly enjoyed our prep call
because I think it's customers like you
and people like you that truly an impact
and help me to realize that when I'm
drinking the Kool-Aid of SmartRecruiters
and Winston, I'm not alone.
and so I am very excited for you to
share just what you've done, uh, in
talent acquisition at Syngenta with AI,
with Winston, with SmartRecruiters, but
more so a proud moment for you and your
organization and what you've achieved.
So I am not going to belabor this
with more fluff, but I want us
to get straight to talking about
what your hiring happy hour is.
So can you share more with our
organization, kind of our, our
listeners, I guess they are our
organization, we're all one, uh, what
this journey has looked like for you?
What was the problem?
What were you looking to
solve, and how did you do that?
what we put this as the AI, um, use cases
for, for this year as, uh, the strategic,
uh, roadmap is, uh, the, the, the top
priority is actually top of the funnel.
So what we did identify is that
majority of the time for our talent
acquisition partners is that where they
spend it at reviewing applications.
Uh, and in some cases, depending from
region to region, it can be thousands of
applications, it can be a few hundreds.
And the estimate is that they spend
thirty to fifty percent of their
time just reviewing applications.
The challenge with that is, sits
is that we see that, uh, first of
all, uh, every recruiter, uh, has
its own, uh, ways of working it.
So w- what we want to address is the
consistency, uh, also the fatigue,
because you know what it's like, uh,
spending hours and hours of reviewing
CVs and, uh, you know, i- i- in all
that, uh, journey, you do tend to miss
out potentially some great candidates.
So that is why we wanted, uh, on one side
to ensure that actually our recruiters
do invest their time, uh, based on their
capabilities to become more strategic
talent acquisition partners and spend
time more, uh, with business and to be
consistent in reviewing applications.
So this is why we started the
discussion with Smartrecruiters,
how can we address actually this
issue with top of the funnel?
And, uh, this is where Winsta Match
and, uh, Winsta Screen came along.
So w- as two really powerful,
uh, tools, especially when you--
when, uh, they join together.
Um, so with Winsta Match, first
of all, what we wanted to, to
use the tool is to help us, um,
connect and prioritize candidates.
And I'm really highlighting on this
because for us it's very important
that, uh, we don't have the, um,
automated decision-making by the AI
tool, but to have, uh, human oversight
and human on- in the loop, meaning that
the talent acquisition partners are
the decision makers and, uh, the tool
itself is helping them to prioritize
candidates by linking, uh, all those
three areas, skills, uh, experience,
and education with the job description.
Uh, making sure that, uh, actually we
see them as a good fit, uh, not only
keywords for keywords where, where
we're looking at the old technology,
but it's rather looking beyond that.
What are the skills
that they can use today?
What are the required
skills for the future?
What is the trajectory and, uh, what is it
that they can actually, uh, use, uh, for
the next stages in their careers, looking
at how they, uh, they grow and progress.
I love this
and this is something what, uh, really,
uh, we are using to, to, to, like I
said, to address, uh, the time being
spent on reviewing candidates and at
the same time to make sure that we can
give an equal opportunities for all the
candidates, especially in those cases
when we have thousands of applications
in some, uh, regions of the world.
Uh, together with that, what, uh, we
started, uh, with the implementation
of, of is for Winston Screen.
And once again, for Winston Screen,
asking those questions, it's not about,
uh, actually looking to disqualify
candidates, but rather to qualify them,
to make sure that actually they have
those little, uh, important things that
maybe they didn't highlight in their
resumes, uh, and that we can actually
qualify them against these positions.
And when you join answers from
Winston Screen and then with Winston
Match, it does give a really great
insightful way for recruiters to go
and actually review, uh, these findings
and also connect with the, the actual
resume of, of candidates and decide
who they want to move forward with
Danny, a few questions for you because
I think this is very powerful, and
recent conversations I've had with a
number of customers, people are still
doing things manually top of funnel.
This is a top priority for
a large, a large enterprise
organizations, which is surprising.
You think that they would be
further along on this journey.
So as they look to this, um, whether
you're large or small, you talked
about Winston Match truly helping
you to m- I guess, uh, narrow the fit
of the individuals while having the
human touch there make the decisions.
Can you share how this
improved the process, right?
When we talked, you said some people were
just starting at the top, some people
were filtering by alphabetical order.
Um, it really was a choose your own
adventure on which candidates were
looked at, and now you eliminate, if
you want to call that, the bias of that,
and everyone has an equal opportunity.
But share with us how you also
helped to improve process with
this by integrating Winston Match
Yeah.
And, uh, that's, that's,
that's a great, uh, connection
we discussed from last time.
And this is, this is the
habits that everybody have.
Um, whoever is in the talent acquisition,
um, industry, they know that, uh, and
whoever went through the path of being
a, a recruiter, we all have our habits.
Do you start from the beginning?
Do you start from the end?
You start from this week because,
oh, Monday is a perfect day,
let me see who applied today.
Um, and, and this is the inconsistency,
uh, which, uh, which we want to address,
um, i-in that sense because, um, you
know, the process is reviewed in that
way that once again, you give an equal
opportunity to everyone, and you make
sure that by, uh, by starting, okay,
I'll start from the end, and then there
are 500 candidates who already applied.
You're not going to go from the, the
first 50, and potentially maybe you
have the best fit candidates in there.
So in this way, actually the
prioritization goes based on their
experience, based on their skill
set, based on their education,
and ranking them in that area.
What we did highlight and what we
actually, uh, follow as, uh, w- some--
I will share some findings so far,
is that actually, uh, recruiters
are reviewing candidates from all
the scores because we are still
learning how to utilize the tool.
And also, um, you know, to be frank, we
all always want to assess and see what
is the reliability of the tool, and, uh,
uh, you know, you have false positives,
false negatives, and how do we address
that to make sure that we actually don't
miss out on some of the candidates.
That's why we have the process that,
uh, the, the recruiters are actually
reviewing not only the high- uh, higher
score candidates, meaning four and
threes, threes, but actually reviewing
ones and twos to make sure that, uh, we
do, we do and, um, randomly check the
candidates to, to see if actually the
tool does give us the best fit candidates.
the process,
To explain this
yeah, please
as when you listen to the radio,
I'm aging myself, I would every
channel before I chose my song.
And I find that to be the same validating
factor of, okay, well, I wanna make sure
I'm not missing the good stuff, right?
So you do have to look at those ones
and twos to see if it's truly reliable.
Um, and I appreciate this exercise
Yes, yes.
Because we are also playing the, the
curiosity game because, you know, you
have to be curious and, uh, if, if you
really want to get all the answers, you
have to, to, uh, to see what's in there.
Uh, what is, what is important
finding for us is that, uh, we
did, uh, um, so the, the recruiters
reviewed 11 and 22% for scores one,
scores two, and then a bit higher
percentage around thir- 30 percentage
each, uh, for the threes and fours.
What we can learn so far after,
what's been now, five months of, uh,
utilizing Winster Match is that more
than 60% of candidates who's been,
uh, um, reviewed and scored for,
they move into the interview stage.
So it does show you that actually
the tool can be treated as reliable.
Still, we do continue reviewing
all the level of, uh, candidates
because, you know, some- sometimes
happens that, uh, candidates are
not, not professional CV writers.
Uh, and even though that the tool is,
um, actually applying much, much more
complex technology than it used to be in
the past, depending on the file type and
how they upload it, it can happen that,
uh, some of the things can be missed out.
So that's why we want to make sure that we
give this equal opportunity to everyone.
So the process has changed in the
sense that we can see that, uh, the
small- uh, the, the smaller number
of applications has been reviewed,
but then the quality is still there.
We can see that, uh, there are less
candidates moving forward to the
interview stage and actually affecting
the number of interviews to hires as well.
So this is something what we can learn
from an early stage, really proving that
actually it does reduce the time that
you spend at the top of the funnel, uh,
and also, uh, improving the quality, uh,
of the candidates being moved forward
this because we get asked all the
time, like, how do we validate that
the people at the top of that list
from match are the right people?
And you are giving us an external
customer data point to say 60% of
the time those fours move forward.
So thank you for that.
I want to go to screen because
I, like you, think this is like a
perfect marriage top of funnel, right?
This is where we hear a lot of our
customers say, you know, "Can I
customize the matching?" And we say
no, and there's a number of reasons
related to bias and legislation and, and
allowing the tool to do what it does.
But I think this is where the element
of screen truly is a powerful, uh,
second component to this, and actually
probably the first considering it's
part of the screening question.
So weighted screening questions, then
those also with match are prioritized.
Give us an example of a screening
question that you, and without, you
know, all those that are going to
apply to jobs at Syngenta after this
will know, but that helps you to truly
validate what you said earlier around
knowing that they have that expertise
or that certification or that capability
that you need to move them forward.
Yeah.
Uh, the questions can vary, uh, because we
are looking at the, the, the global scope.
Uh, so it can vary from region to region.
When I say region, for instance,
North America, Europe, in,
uh, EMEA, then LATAM, Brazil.
So it can vary depending on what
are the, the, the key, uh, elements
important, also with the function.
So for instance, uh, in Europe, uh,
it-- we can come across if someone is
eligible to work in the country, and
you have some-sometimes a great fit of a
candidate who does require sponsorship.
And if we don't provide a sponsorship,
uh, the, the recruiters, uh, wouldn't
invest time to go for the phone screen
interview with the candidates only
to find out that, uh, some of the
candidates do require sponsorship.
So this is something what you can
apply in certain, um, in certain
countries where this is very important.
Also, it's really important to highlight
that, uh, you have to be cautious what
kind of questions you ask in the different
regions and different countries, because
what you can ask, for instance, in India,
it can be illegal to be asked in different
country, like in, in US or in Europe.
Um, what we see a lot of value is
also, for instance, for IT and digital
function, where you have to be very
specific ab-about certain technologies
that, uh, candidates spend time
working and for what period of time.
Because, you know, just using
one language doesn't say enough.
It-it's about the, the,
the tool that they use it.
And this can help you also
to understand what is the
qualification of the candidate.
Once again, I really need to,
to emphasize this, this, that we
are not using Winston Screen to
disqualify any of the candidates.
The, the, the sole purpose is really
to qualify them, to link their
experience, skills, uh, a-and the
knowledge they have in the role to
make sure that they actually do, do
have all the key requirements that
they need to be successful in the job.
Going back to that top of the funnel,
how that saves time to recruiters,
you know that when you pick up the
phone and when you talk to candidates
for that phone screen interview, you
don't just ask a question and you
receive no, and you hang up the phone.
Hopefully, not many people are using.
Exactly.
You would have still to go through
those fifteen to twenty minutes
of phone screen interview when you
realize from the very beginning that
the candidate is not a good fit.
And this is where you really reduce
this number of phone screen, phone
screens that are being performed by
recruiter before you decide how many
candidates you want to move forward
to the, uh, to hiring manager review
and, uh, later to the interview stage
So you may or may not know this, but
I think that you are a celebrity in
your organization because of this
effort and what you've achieved.
What has been some of the praise that
recruiters and hiring managers have
given around the exponential time
that Syngenta is saving top of funnel?
we still don't have… So I, I don't
want to throw the numbers like,
uh, based on the, the gut feeling.
So I'm very, uh, data-driven,
so I, I don't like to play
with the incorrect information.
So far, because, uh, we implemented,
um, uh, Winston Screen on, uh,
uh, 7th of September, so it, it's
still early stage, I would say.
So, so far we have a qualitative
feedback coming from recruiters, and
we actually recently went out with a
survey as well, uh, asking them, "How
do you feel that, uh, Winston Match and
Winston Screen is impacting, uh, your
work?" And we have a lot of positive,
uh, responses, uh, especially those
who started using Winston Screen more
and more r- for the, all the reasons
that I just mentioned, because they can
actually spend less time finding answers
that they, they have already provided
through these, uh, Winston Screen.
So I don't have the data
to support this yet.
Maybe in the near future Sometimes
it's also about the feeling, uh, that
something is actually creating an
impact on your, uh, day, uh, day work
I would say that, uh, uh, we
will have another one, and
we'll look at engagement, right?
Like hiring manager, recruiter
engagement, how many of your users
are using this with rave reviews?
Two, we'll look at quality of
hire, and then the no-brainer,
you know, top of funnel, uh, time
savings, which equals cost savings.
So, uh, we will come back to all of that.
But I wanna know where
you're going next, right?
You have done an amazing job of rolling
out Match and now Screen, um, excited
to help those recruiters and other
users, and even the candidate experience
top of funnel as we think about, you
know, making sure they're not stagnant
for too long and no communication.
Exactly
for Syngenta going next?
So we are discussing our roadmap, and we
are looking for different technologies
and different solutions that can
help us further, uh, on the path.
How you can, uh, um, make the
whole journey a bit easier,
to automate the process.
Still, uh, the, the intention is
not for us at least to replace, uh,
the, the, the, the, the human or
the recruiters with their job, but
really to make their life easier.
Once again, going back at the beginning,
we want them to, to be able to be closer
to the business, to become strategic
partners, strategic talent acquisition
partners, where they can have much,
much more qualitative discussions with
the hiring managers, uh, and to ensure
that they actually have a chance to,
to perform all the capabilities they
have and also to, to excel further
and grow into, uh, their roles.
So, uh, the whole roadmap is about how
can we make everybody's life easier
in, from one side recruiters and also
looking for the solutions how we can
actually embed, uh, either agents or
different, uh, ways for candidates to
find all the answers they, that they need.
And what we want to, to also address
is how do we encourage them to apply
for the roles where they are good fit.
Because in the past, uh, I can
say, uh, by being 14 years in the
industry, we w- we were really focusing
on how do we attract candidates.
And i- it was important, like, okay, we
need to attract them, but now it's about
the quality because you want to attract
a good quality of candidates because
nobody's benefiting from the numbers.
Uh, having hundreds and thousands of a-
applicants, nobody's benefiting from that.
So we want to see how we can actually
use the technology to give, uh, needed
answers and to help actually candidates
to see whether they are potentially
good fit for certain roles or to guide
them to help them to, to find a good fit
roles for themselves they can apply for
love this.
So last question before
we learn more about you.
What would be your advice
to an organization that is
considering Match and/or Screen?
Um, where do they start, and what
is a must-have as you think about
going through this transformation?
first of all, uh, what we started
and what I think is the important
thing is to understand what is
the problem that you want to fix.
Uh, and I think this
is the, the key thing.
Uh, and to explore, uh, all the options.
Uh, what I really love is the
curiosity base, meaning that always
be curious about what are the
opportunities you can gain from.
Uh, and I, I think this is really
important aspect, uh, because without
trying certain things, you will never
know what's-- uh, whether something worked
or not, because, you know, better to
try and fail than never to try things.
And I think it's inevitable really
to, to, to see how the technology, uh,
can, uh, help us in day to d- uh, day
life because some people are scared.
You can hear a lot of talks about AI
taking over our jobs, which I really
don't believe that, uh, it will happen.
Maybe to a certain percentage, but not
on the scale where everybody's afraid of.
It's like the introduction from
paper, you move to, to computers.
Did computers replace all the jobs?
No, they didn't.
But what is really important is that,
once again, with the curiosity and
with the growth mindset, you have to
continuously invest in yourself and
adapt yourself to the future and to
the te- technology that you have.
So obviously upskilling teams, uh, helping
them understand what is the main benefit
from that is also a important aspect
because you have to get that in mind
and you have to, to take away that there
is no place for fear in, in this game.
It's all about let's work together
in seeing what are the, what are
the things we can be better at
because that can help us grow
I love that.
It's the value selling.
What's in it for me in partnership
with AI versus in replacement.
So, um, great,
Exactly.
for our audience and our listeners.
All right, Danny, we are going to
switch to learn more about this curious
gentleman with me on the screen, and
what your personal happy hour is.
What brings a smile to
your face outside of work?
Oh, outside of my work?
Oof, uh, many things.
I mean, you know, it, it is common
thing people saying about, um, uh,
you know, family and kids, and this,
this is definitely something what, uh,
shaped all of us or changed all of us.
Uh, what I personally like, uh, to, to,
to do is to challenge myself and, uh,
Okay.
I'm a curious person, so in that
sense, in find different ways,
uh, of seeing where my limits are,
so for instance, I played rugby, um,
uh, European rugby, um, for 18 years
in the past and, uh, for the last 11
years I moved into different thing.
It's in triathlon, uh, and
doing the Ironman and just
seeing where the boundaries are.
And, uh, you know, just want
to see what we are capable of.
And actually that helps a lot, uh,
because you can really see, uh, it's
not about overcoming challenges,
uh, on a physical level because
you're all prepared for that.
But actually on the mental level,
because you can apply that throughout
life because, uh, you know, in life
we come across many difficult moments.
Uh, but then the, the question is how you
approach that and how you deal with all
those moments and how you react to it.
And this is something what,
uh, um, helped me through the
sport because you had a all…
a, a lot of ups and downs.
You had a lot of, um, uh, dark moments,
meaning the physical endurance.
And, uh, definitely this is, this is
something what, uh, I really love to
challenge myself and also to be capable
to, to, to be there with kids and
challenging them as well, uh, through
that mindset because it helps them grow.
What I would like also to, uh, to connect
with the personal and the work-related,
uh, because, um, as I'm in coaching,
certified in coaching and helping a
lot of people to, to grow and develop,
this is something what I really,
that
uh, brings a lot of joy in,
in the work environment.
Um, and especially helping people grow
because for me, this is, uh, this is the
heritage that we can always look back at
and, uh, how many people you helped shape
up, develop, helping grow in their careers
and becoming who they are, uh, today.
I love that.
I love that because I can see it in you
that you are proud of all those that
you have helped impact in your org.
Now, my one question related to Ironmans
or just triathlons, you-- first of all,
you're insanely awesome for doing those.
I think I did a half
and that was my limit.
Which one, uh, which or segment provides
you the best opportunity to think?
Is it the run, the swim, or the bike?
Ooh, that's a great question.
Uh, so I'm a non-swimmer.
I mean, I never trained swimming,
it is the part we all hate at the moment.
But you know, funny thing is, um, funny
thing is that once you come to the point
and what I say you need to go at least
like, uh, 60 miles or 100 kilometers
plus, uh, in the water to start not hating
So I did like a regular Ironman, like
the flat-ish ones, and then I wanted
to try myself with the extreme one.
So extreme is more into mountains.
It's a lot of, uh, climbing on a bike, um,
off-road and run, like going to the peaks.
And there is one which I-- which
has a special, uh, part in my heart.
It's, uh, in Montenegro.
Uh, it's called the Black Lake Extreme,
uh, Triathlon because you swim in a lake
which is on, uh, one-- 1,500 meters,
uh, altitude, and it's beautiful.
It's, it's so nice.
And the funny thing about the extreme,
um, um, let's call it Ironman because
it's the Ironman distance, uh, is that
you actually, uh, you start at, uh,
4:30 in the morning, so it's during
the night, and you swim in the dark.
So literally there are
lights you have to follow.
Uh, you see like blinking
lights from the other swimmers.
And usually that it's not overcrowded
like you would see in other races.
So at some point, especially when, uh, it,
it's coming to, to the dawn slightly, so
it's not like pitch black, but slightly
you can see your, your, your eyes
get used to, uh, to the, to the dark.
You can see like the mountains,
you can see the trees, and you
really connect with nature.
So it's literally darkness in there.
You just have your stroke,
and you know what it's like.
You just have the stroke,
the peace, silence.
You just see like the
mountains, and it's beautiful.
So, you know, in those moments,
once you stop hating it,
swimming can be really good.
Uh, but you know, uh, I don't think that
on the run you have a chance to, to, to
enjoy anything because it's the last bit
and, uh, the marathon is waiting for you.
So marathon on its own, it's, uh, it's
not fun, but, uh, after 180 kilometers
on a bike, it's definitely not fun,
All
at all.
So yeah.
Funny thing is, I would say swimming does
give you a chance to really connect with
yourself, especially when it's in nature,
danny, I will take your word for it.
Um, we're gonna get into the
third part, which is my favorite.
It's a game of this or that.
So, um, you choose one, you choose
both, you elaborate, you don't have to.
We've got about 10 of them, okay?
You ready?
Okay.
Yeah, go for it
AI-powered prioritization or
humor- human-powered intuition
Ooh, AI powered
Review 1,000 applications or
interview 10 qualified candidates
Uh, interview 12-- 10 qualified candidates
more too.
Uh, save time or save money
Isn't that connected in some way?
Say both.
Both
Uh, yes, it is.
More applicants or better matches?
Ah, better matches always.
Perfect resume or perfect potential?
Ooh, I would go with growth potentials
First to apply or best fit for the role
Uh, best fit for the role
keywords or capabilities
Uh, capabilities
Speed to interview or quality of hire
kind of quality of hire
as a co-pilot or AI as a game changer?
Ooh, can I go with both?
All right, now we're gonna get to
some fun ones, not work related.
Uh, sunrise
Okay.
Sunrise.
mountains or ocean?
Mountains
Coffee or tea?
Uh, a lot of coffee, espresso.
you know that has less
caffeine than coffee?
Uh, it depends how you make it
and what is the quantity you have.
So yeah.
I'm throwing one in here.
If, you know, you had your
superhero body, Rugby or Iron Man?
Ooh, that's a tough one.
It's a different stage of my life.
I love them both.
I hear you.
I hear you
It's completely different.
I, I, I don't think it's uncomparable.
Rugby, it's a team sport where
you have different challenges.
You know what they say in rugby?
It's 80 minutes of pretending that you
are not, uh, injured so you can stay
on the, stay with the team members.
Honestly, I, I played more injured than
I played, uh, uh, healthy on that game.
But Ironman is completely different
because it connects more with you
e- because it's only you there.
There is nobody else to save you.
It's just
You.
Dig deep.
Okay.
Definitely
Um, last one.
Beer, wine, or spirits?
Oh, I'm not, I'm not,
I'm not… Uh, spirits.
Yeah.
I'm not into alcohol, but
I would go for spirits
well, what do you do after an Ironman?
What is, what is your thing after
an Ironman to reward yourself?
it depends when.
Uh, so straight after that, you
just get to, to hydrate something
Share.
and go into the cold
pool to, to cool down.
But then the day after, you're looking
for another race, another challenge.
Okay
Even though the whole time
you, you thought like, "Why the
hell did I sign up for this?"
lot about you, Danny.
I have learned a lot about your mentality.
I love it.
I absolutely love it.
Um, tell our friends that are
listening or watching, uh,
where they can connect with you
Uh, well, LinkedIn is, uh, probably the
easiest way, uh, to, to connect and,
uh, to reach out for any questions.
I'm always, uh, happy to connect,
share any experience we have, uh, in,
in the topic we discussed today, for
instance, match and screen or anything
in, uh, related to talent acquisition,
or if they want to make a mistake
in life and go with, uh, Iron Man.
I was just gonna say.
thank you, Danny, for being here today and
for sharing your insight and just, like,
the perseverance and mindset that you
have as it relates to both life and work.
Um, listeners, watchers,
I hope you enjoyed this.
I know I did.
I mean, while I am curious about
Ironmans, I think w- I'll, I'll stay the
track of, you know, just trail running
or, or something along those lines.
But if you do have interest in any of
the topics today, Winston match, Screen,
um, also just TA or career development,
and Ironmans, Danny is the man for you.
Uh, thank you all for
staying tuned with us.
Uh, more to come on the horizon.
And then of course, if you or
have a friend or want to be
on the show, please reach out.
Thanks everyone.